Working Group Minutes/SWG 2011-07-04

From OpenStreetMap Foundation


IRC Name Present Apologies
_chrisfl Chris Fleming y
Eugene Eugene Usvitsky y
toffehoff Henk Hoff y

Minutes (Draft)

From previous meeting:

  • Henk to ask board what the minimum fee for corporate membership should be. No board meeting so this action is carried over.

This week:

  • Boardmembers are elected for 2 years.
  • Boardmembers can stand for re-election (no maximum terms).
  • During elections, members can indicate who they prefer as chairperson.


  • Henk to ask board what the minimum fee for corporate membership should be.
  • Scan the current AoA to see whether we have missed something.

Next Week:

  • Next meeting: 18:00 UTC Monday 11th July 2011

AoA Review document


19:10   *** chrisfl_ joined #osm-strategic 

19:10 toffehoff Hi Chris! 

19:11 chrisfl_ HI sorry, totally lost track of timr 

19:11 chrisfl_ time even 

19:11 toffehoff I also loose stuff sometimes :-) 

19:12 toffehoff Am going to current AoA to see if we missed something. 

19:12 chrisfl_ good plan 

19:12 toffehoff ... and that needs to be addressed ... 

19:13 chrisfl_ I'll have a read through as well 

19:23 toffehoff Just some questions popping up: 

19:23 toffehoff - Who appoints/elects the officers? 

19:24 chrisfl_ The board decide amongst themselves? 

19:25 toffehoff Even the chair? 

19:25 chrisfl_ why not? 

19:25 toffehoff The chairperson is/should be the figurehead of the organisation. 

19:26 toffehoff The leading person.... 

19:27 chrisfl_ yes... so how else would we decide on the chair? 

19:28 toffehoff We could make the chairperson a special position the membership can elect a person to. 

19:28 toffehoff Separate of the other positions within board. 

19:29 toffehoff Thinking of it....  

19:29 chrisfl_ So the question is, this could get quite complicated. Can you stand for both the board and the chair? 

19:30 toffehoff .... and what to do when the chair resigns. 

19:30 chrisfl_ yes. 

19:30 toffehoff But, yes, you could run for board and chair. 

19:30 toffehoff First elect the chair. Then elect the other board members. 

19:30 chrisfl_ If the whole board is elected, hopefully the most obvious leader would be the chair 

19:31 chrisfl_ Also makes "e-mail" voting much harder. 

19:31 toffehoff Sure, just throwing it out .... 

19:31 toffehoff I can image we would have some discussion with the membership about this. 

19:32 chrisfl_ yes; what what would happen if more than one board member wants to be chair and the board. 

19:32   *** Eugene joined #osm-strategic 

19:32 toffehoff Hi Eugene. 

19:32 chrisfl_ hi Eugene 

19:32 Eugene Hello Henk and Chris! 

19:33 toffehoff Just started to go through the current AoA to see if we missed something. 

19:33 Eugene I'm extremely sorry - it's holiday here in US and I simply forgot that it's also a Monday :( 

19:33 toffehoff Now stumbled on the question on who is electing the chairperson. 

19:34 toffehoff No problem. Great to have you, even during your holiday :-) 

19:34 Eugene Thanks! :) 

19:34 Eugene And what is the question? 

19:34 toffehoff Should the board appoint the chairperson amongst itself, or should it be elected by the membership? 

19:35 Eugene A... 

19:35 toffehoff We were discussing some practical issues if you would choose the latter. 

19:35 chrisfl_ During the board election we could also get the electorate to indicate who they want to be the chair person? 

19:36 chrisfl_ 2 votes in one. 

19:36 toffehoff chrisfl_ : interesting thought. 

19:37 Eugene The board option is better IMHO. It's simpler to get an answer from them and the chance it'll be a really good chairperson (and not simply the most well-known like Steve) is higher.  

19:37 Eugene But Chris's idea is also good. 

19:38 toffehoff I like the idea of the membership having some say in who's becoming chair. 

19:38 toffehoff I would go with the 2 votes in one idea of Chris. 

19:39 toffehoff let's see how this will be received in the proposal :-) 

19:40 toffehoff Ok with that? 

19:40 chrisfl_ I am  :) 

19:41 toffehoff Eugene already mentioned he liked the idea as well. 

19:41 toffehoff "liked" actually meaning "good idea". 

19:41 chrisfl_ :) 

19:41 toffehoff Sorry Eugene :-) 

19:42 toffehoff Other subject: rotation of members of board. 

19:42 toffehoff For how long are board members elected (how many positions on the board should be elected each year) 

19:43 chrisfl_ ideally we would elect half the board each year? 

19:43 chrisfl_ so board members would stand for 2 days. 

19:43 chrisfl_ s/days/years/ 

19:43 toffehoff Pfuuuw 

19:44 toffehoff Can a board member run for re-election? 

19:44 chrisfl_ yes 

19:44 toffehoff ... and how often? 

19:45 chrisfl_ don't think we need to put an upper limit on it? 

19:45 Eugene 2 years seems too long but changing half of the board every 6 months is worse. So yes, each member for 2 years. 

19:46 Eugene Not more than 2 re-elections (total of 3 times in board). 

19:46 Eugene Or even 1 re-election but we don't have a lot of people to form the Board :) 

19:46 toffehoff btw: the current idea is that each year a third will be up for election. 

19:47 chrisfl_ I think we currently have some good experienced board members and I think it would be a shame if they reach a point where they can't re-stand. 

19:47 toffehoff Eugene: so a max of 6 years on the board. 

19:47 Eugene with 2-year scheme - yes. 

19:48 chrisfl_ If 1/3rd stand for re-election then how does this work with a 2 year term? 

19:48 toffehoff Currently: it doesn't :-) 

19:49 chrisfl_ I would be happy with 1/3rd and 3 year terms. 

19:49 toffehoff Keep in mind that also during their term, members can resign. 

19:50 chrisfl_ Yes.  

19:50 toffehoff You may end up with electing more new people to the board .... 

19:50 chrisfl_ I have seen something along the lines of x% of the board members who have gone the longest time since being elected. 

19:50 Eugene And how many members currently resigned? 3 years is too long period, for this project especially. 

19:51 toffehoff At the moment 1 person has resigned. 

19:51 toffehoff ... within a year. 

19:52 chrisfl_ yes so for half the board +1 would stand at the next AGM under the 2 year rule. 

19:53 Eugene And during the whole project life? 2-3, not more? 

19:54 toffehoff Before I'm getting confused: what's the suggested rule: 2 year or 3 year term? 

19:54 chrisfl_ I don't think there is any advantages to setting a maximum number of terms 

19:54 chrisfl_ I think we're suggesting 2 year terms. 

19:54 toffehoff Ok 

19:55 toffehoff The maximum number of terms.... 

19:55 chrisfl_ I think no maximum 

19:56 toffehoff I can see a point in setting a maximum, but I also see the disadvantage.... 

19:56 chrisfl_ so as long as the members are happy to vote; because it's more important to have the best people for the job. 

19:57 Eugene +1 

19:57 toffehoff So: no maximum? 

19:58 chrisfl_ I think no maximum. 

19:58 Eugene Ok, no maximum 

19:58 chrisfl_ toffehoff there is no escape.... 

19:59 toffehoff :-).... I can always not run for re-election :-) 

19:59 toffehoff ... or can't I .... 

19:59 chrisfl_ indeed :) SOMEONE will bend your arm :) 

20:01 toffehoff .... oh look at the time .... 

20:01 toffehoff (changing subjects) 

20:01 chrisfl_ :) 

20:02 chrisfl_ Are we discussing this stuff at SOTM-EU? 

20:03 toffehoff I'm still hoping we can. 

20:03 chrisfl_ cool 

20:04 toffehoff Can we put a task on ourselves to have a look through the current AoA to see whether we haven't forgotting anything substancial? 

20:04 chrisfl_ sounds like a plan 

20:04 toffehoff Hope we can have Francis in the meeting next week. 

20:04 chrisfl_ hopefully anything we've missed will be get picked up in the drafting of the new articles? 

20:04 toffehoff If we have something, maybe we could mail it around or add it to the review doc? 

20:05 chrisfl_ sounds good. 

20:06 Eugene yes 

20:06 toffehoff ... heading home now ...  

20:06 toffehoff Have a good week 

20:06 toffehoff Enjoy holiday! 

20:06 chrisfl_ cool, have a good week. 

20:07 Eugene Thanks! Have a good week, too!