Licensing Working Group/Minutes/2024-10-07

From OpenStreetMap Foundation

OpenStreetMap Foundation, Licensing Working Group (LWG) - Agenda & Minutes
7 October 2024, 17:00 UTC

Participants

  • Kathleen Lu (Chairing)
  • Dermot McNally
  • Simon Hughes
  • Tom Lee (until ~52’ after start)
  • Guillaume Rischard (OSMF board) (joined ~15’ until ~52’ after start)

Absent

  • Tom Hummel (Apologies)

Administrative

Adoption of past minutes

Previous action items

  • 2018-03-08 All to look at the Working Groups collecting personal information.
  • 2018-04-12 LWG to follow-up on the iD editor, as the number of changesets is now included on the changeset comments thread.
  • 2020-10-08 Simon Poole and Guillaume Rischard to look at the translation issue of the copyright policy page
  • 2020-10-08 Jim Vidano to work on updating the privacy policy in relation to OSMF's use of a commercial CDN, and Kathleen Lu will have a look at it.
  • 2021-02-11 Kathleen Lu to check LWG-specific membership requirements on the OSMF website and Conflict of Interest policy and provide to Dorothea any updates for the website.
  • 2021-03-11 Guillaume Rischard to sort out various email issues - Making sure Dermot McNally is on the main legal mailing issue, making sure everyone is getting OTRS email notifications for the legal queue.
  • 2021-07-08 Guillaume Rischard to meet with Dermot McNally about using OTRS.
  • 2021-07-08 LWG members to provide comment on the HOT draft trademark agreement on the next meeting.
  • 2021-07-08 Jim Vidano to look at next steps for Opensnowmap.org paperwork after the trademark request has been approved by the board.
  • 2021-07-08 Dermot McNally to ask Tobias for expected outcome regarding the request for change of the text of the standard tile license.
  • 2021-08-12 Tom Hummel to suggest text to be published regarding OSMF's legitimate interest in processing personal data.
  • 2021-08-12 Dermot McNally to reply to Tobias about simplifying the text of the tile licence.
  • 2021-08-12 Dermot McNally to make the pull request on GitHub openstreemap-website regarding attribution requirements for OSMF tiles
  • 2021-08-12 Dermot McNally to communicate back to contacts regarding Australian data attribution and suggest filling the waiver template.
  • 2021-08-12 LWG to identify OSMF legal texts that might be needed under German law to be in German.
  • 2021-09-09 Jim Vidano to ask Simon Poole whether he has previous emails contacting companies that were not displaying attribution.
  • 2021-09-09 Guillaume Rischard to check past emails (e.g. last year ones related to case in Germany where they settled in court) for any sent to companies not complying with attribution requirements and to send what he finds, including links to the GitHub repositories with the lists of not complying organisations, to the Signal group.
  • 2021-09-09 Jim Vidano and Dermot McNally (2021-12-09) to create a draft template email for the community to contact organisations regarding non compliance with the attribution guidelines
  • 2021-09-09 Dermot McNally to reply to Jean-Marc Liotier (board of directors) with the LWG decision to create a template email for minor cases of non-compliance with the attribution guidelines available to the community and the LWG to directly contact bigger companies.
  • 2022-01-13 Simon Hughes to download a copy of the Copyright FAQ page and mark anything that is not matching the attribution guidelines or is confusing and circulate that to the LWG.
  • 2022-04-14 Guillaume Rischard to ask Tom Hughes to see how many translations of the Copyright and Copyright FAQ page are live. Topic Needed: Update to Copyright FAQ page to match new attribution guidelines
  • 2022-09-15 Dermot McNally to send an email to the companies mentioned on Ticket#2022011910000082 and Ticket#202201261000014
  • 2022-09-15 Guillaume Rischard to respond to the email Ticket#202208041000024 and redirect to the right person.
  • 2022-10-13 Guillaume Rischard to take the Ticket#2022100310000013 issue to the board (related to legal consequences for “unlicensed surveying”)
  • 2022-11-10 Guillaume Rischard to pass the message to the board member who wrote to the LWG about Open Database License (ODbL).
  • 2023-03-06 Kathleen Lu to write back to Iiro Laiho (Inquiry re Finnish satellite imagery) and have them clarify that the attribution is ok. The LWG to update the attribution.
  • 2023-04-03 Guillaume Rischard to ask Grant Slater regarding passing LWG tickets to OWG.
  • 2023-04-03 Dermot McNally to find wording that makes it clear to the recipients of the love letters that the letters come from mappers.
  • 2023-04-03 Guillaume Rischard to send the Attribution Guidelines (Case of German Federal Mapping Agency buried attribution)
  • 2023-04-03 Tom Lee to reply to the OSM Serbia community on GitHub asking for additional details (Ticket#2023030810000178 - Serbian Geodata)
  • 2023-04-03 Dermot McNally to put Benito Romualdo Palma Temoaya in touch with the Mexican community (Ticket#2023032410000272 – Asesoría)
  • 2023-11-13 Tom Lee to create a draft statement by the next LWG meeting that could be used by the board to encourage governments to publish under CC0, ODbL, OGL or with a waiver to OSM. [Topic: Ordnance Survey Ireland waiver - Update by Dermot McNally]
  • 2023-11-13 Tom Hummel to read https://open.nrw/system/files/media/document/file/opennrw_rechtl_gutachten_datenlizenzen_lowres_web.pdf https://open.nrw/verwendung-von-open-data-lizenzen [Topic: Ticket#2023110610000184 - Importing Austrian governmental data]m to add to add the following two templat
  • 2023-11-13 Tom Hummel to contact Falk, a lawyer from the German local chapter, and get his opinion on the general stance of mid-level governmental agencies. Estimated to have a response by early December. [Topic: Ticket#2023110610000184 - Importing Austrian governmental data]
  • 2024-01-08 Kathleen Lu to contact Lawdit and enquire about the cost estimate for opposing the trademark registration by UMBRAOSM.
  • 2024-01-08 Kathleen Lu to reply to Kirill Fedotov that the new MapBuilder designs for OSM account sign-ups look good.
  • 2024-01-08 Tom Hummel to reply to the last email about rescheduling the meeting regarding the Austrian governmental datasets , cc Dermot McNally and try to schedule a new date.
  • 2024-01-08 Kathleen Lu to reply to the reporter that, per horizontal layers, what was done with the Organic Maps feature related to https://github.com/organicmaps/organicmaps/pull/6523/commits/51b3fc992e66e49b4c9a77e3d3fb05d99027baf5 is fine for data about hotel booking, and enquire about further concerns.
  • 2024-01-08 Kathleen Lu to contact OWG regarding Matomo tracking (Q5: is there a delay after which old IP addresses are anonymised and Q6: For how long is Matomo tracking information retained by OSMF). LWG to answer questions one to four, providing the reasoning.
  • 2024-01-08 Kathleen Lu to forward this request for permission to use the OSM trademarks on the domains: osm.tips, osmtips.de, osmtips.eu, osmtips.org, osmtips.com to the board.
  • 2024-01-08 Guillaume Rischard to send an attribution love letter to OpenGeoHub, regarding OpenLandMap.
  • 2024-01-08 Guillaume Rischard to talk with Tom Hummel, before the latter talks to Falke.
  • 2024-01-08 Guillaume Rischard to provide a summary regarding the German federal cartography agency issue at the next meeting.
  • 2024-02-12 Guillaume Rischard to ask UMBRAOSM for a copy of their filling change request. [UMBRAOSM UNIÃO DOS MAPEADORES BRASILEIROS DO OPENSTREETMAP]
  • 2024-02-12 Kathleen Lu to email OSMtips and send them the template for project and domain grandfathering applications. [Topic: 2)OSM.tips and related domains]
  • 2024-02-12 Kathleen Lu to email OpenLandCover and suggest template https://osmfoundation.org/wiki/Project_Licence_and_Domain_Grandfathering_Application [Topic: 3)Query from Mateusz re OpenLandCoverMap]
  • 2024-02-12 Simon Hughes to provide the difference in number of POIs between the old and new datasets provided by Geolytica to TomTom. [Topic: Geolytica]
  • 2024-02-12 Kathleen Lu and Tom Hummel to talk with Sarah. [Topic: OSMF transfer plan scope of work quote from law firm]
  • 2024-02-12 Kathleen Lu to write back to EWG to ask for clarifications. [Topic: EWG enquiry about https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/GDPR/Affected_Services update]
  • 2024-02-12 Jim Vidano to contact the website with an attribution love letter https://osmfoundation.org/wiki/Licence/Attribution_Reminder_Templates [Topic: Ticket#2024011610000011]
  • 2024-02-12 Kathleen Lu to write back to inquirer that we will add to the copyright page, and that they should notify the Danish data authority that they will be represented on the /copyright alongside all our other prominent sources (there not being anything listed on the front page). Or you can get a CC waiver. Also cc Tom Lee [Ticket#2024020610000298]
  • 2024-02-12 Tom Lee to reply [Topic: application for forward geocoding addresses in Germany]
  • 2024-03-04 Dermot McNally to reply to Markus and suggest setting-up a meeting with the Austrian government. Tom Hummel would be interested to join. [Meeting with Brigitte Lutz/Austrian gov and OSMF Austria LC]
  • 2024-03-04 Jim Visano to finalise the letter to https://www.casaseneleste.com and bcc the LWG. Kathleen will add the letter to the LWG shared folder.
  • 2024-03-04 Kathleen Lu to write back that this OGL Ontario lecence is okay, please add to https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Contributors#Canada before using [ODbL compatibility with Open Government License - Ontario]
  • 2024-03-04 Kathleen Lu to write back that this OGL Nanaimo is okay, please add to https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Contributors#Canada before using [ [ODbL compatibility with OGL Nanaimo License - Ticket#2024030210000114]
  • /2024-04-08 Kathleen Lu to reply to Sarah indicating that the LWG is not completely confident in the firm. Therefore, there is a risk of investing money and time in something that may not be the most effective use of resources. However, both the board and the LWG can monitor the situation closely. Additionally, any delay would also come with associated costs. [OSMF transfer plan scope of work quote from law firm]
  • /2024-04-08 Kathleen Lu to write back that based on the slides, NNG seems to try to adhere to ODbL and the community guidelines. [Query from HERE forwarded by the Board]
  • /2024-04-08 Kathleen Lu to reply about the LWG's assessment of Croatia's open licence https://prod-data.gov.hr/en/open-license [Croatia open licence]
  • /2024-04-08 Kathleen Lu to reply about the LWG's assessment of York's Open Data licence https://insights-york.opendata.arcgis.com/documents/york-region-open-data-licence Ticket#2024030710000016 [Assessment of York Open Data licence Ticket#2024030710000016]
  • /2024-04-08 Kathleen Lu to reply. [University of Washington GIS data and layers and university policies Ticket#2024032010000456 Ticket#2024032010000456]
  • /2024-04-08 Kathleen Lu to reply about the LWG's assessment of Open Government License – Toronto [Assessment of Open Government License – Toronto]
  • 2024-05-13 Tom Hummel to ask the Belgian lawyers about tax-deductability of donations. [Topic: OSMF move to the EU]
  • 2024-05-13 Guillaume Rischard to ask Luxembourg lawyers for details on the UK side of migration. [Topic: OSMF move to the EU]
  • 2024-05-13 Guillaume Rischard to review the translation of the community guidelines by OSM France. [Topic: Local Chapter query about translation of community guidelines]
  • 2024-05-13 Kathleen Lu to write back and say that some French speaking members will have a look at the translation but we don’t have resources to officially bless the translation.
  • 2024-06-10 Guillaume Rischard to have a meeting with Tom Hummel, after the former's request, in order to formulate the question to Lawdit. [Topic: OSMF move to the EU ]
  • 2024-07-08 Kathleen Lu to reply to OSM France that we're still reading through, but assuming it looks ok, we can host the french translation on the OSMF website. [Topic: Queries from Local Chapter: OpenStreetMap France]
  • 2024-07-08 Kathleen Lu to reply to sender, mentioning the routing and that geometries are likely to be derivative databases. [Topic: GTFS]
  • 2024-07-08 Dermot McNally to read the email from Jochen again and see if he can draft something. [Topic: Queries from Local Chapter: Email from Jochen/Falk/FOSSGIS]
  • 2024-09-09 Kathleen Lu to write back with approval of the Guelph (Canada) Open Data Licence Version 2.0 and add it to the OSMF page listing local variants of OGL Canada [Topic: Import the latest ArcGIS aerial data into OSM for the city of Guelph]
  • 2024-09-09 Dermot McNally/Tom Hummel to compare notes and email the developer of the App openstreets-4-open-street-map to request a disclaimer to be added to the description of the app. [Topic: Trademarks, App openstreets-4-open-street-map]
  • 2024-09-09 Kathleen Lu to send the grandfathering application form to Pavel Zbytovský of the Czech OSMF Local Chapter, for OsmAPP [Topic: Trademarks, OsmAPP]

New action items from this meeting

  • Simon Hughes to sort with TomTom's IT department why he hasn't been receiving to his TomTom email address the emails sent to legal@osmfoundation.org [Topic: Trademarks - LWG member not getting the OSMF Trademark email notices]
  • Dorothea Kazazi to add Simon's personal email address to the LWG mailing list. [Topic: Trademarks – any updates?]
  • Kathleen Lu to keep an eye on the incoming invoice for the renewal of the Trademark watch notices service. [Topic: Trademarks – any updates?]
  • Dorothea Kazazi to check with the Finance committee if the LWG has 700 GBP left to spend this year for the Argentina trademark renewal. [Topic: Trademarks - Argentina Declaration of Actual Use]
  • Dermot McNally and Guillaume Rischard will discuss Dermot's comments in the LWG Signal chat room and decide on the suitability of the work. [Topic: Queries from Local Chapter: OpenStreetMap France – Translation of community guidelines]
  • Kathleen Lu to reply that data is either CC-BY-SA or ODbL, depending on the date of the data. [Topic: Licensing of OSM GPS traces #56357] - Done
  • Kathleen Lu to add a note on the OSMF website https://osmfoundation.org/wiki/OGL_Canada_and_local_variants, so that before submitting, people can look at some of the Canadian licences examples and tell us if there is any difference, beyond the region and name. [Topic: Government of Alberta licence #5665] - Done
  • Kathleen Lu to open an OPS issue, so that Tom Hughes can fix it. [Topic: Austria dead link on Copyright page] - Done
  • Kathleen Lu to email Kamil Monicz. [Topic: Next Generation OpenStreetMap and osm.ng]
  • Kathleen Lu to reply to Amiria Maher. [Topic: Choosing names similar to OpenStreetMap in Persian #56267] - Done

Any updates on reported attribution cases?

Reports in OTRS:

Trademarks – any updates?

LWG member not getting the OSMF Trademark email notices

Simon Hughes hasn't been getting the OSMF Trademark email notices to his TomTom email address for some time, even if they are received by the rest of the LWG almost weekly. The latest Trademark notice was sent: 30 September 2024. The last one that Simon received: 30 January 2024. There might be an issue with his spam filter, but there isn't anything is his spam folder either.

Action items

  • Simon to sort with TomTom's IT department why he hasn't been receiving to his TomTom email address the emails sent to legal@osmfoundation.org
  • Dorothea to add Simon's personal email address to the LWG mailing list.
  • Kathleen to keep an eye on the incoming invoice for the renewal of the Trademark watch notices service.

Tom Lee joined ~7 minutes after start.'

Renewal of SotM mark registration in the US

Re: US Registration Number: 5583071 - State of the Map - §71 Due 16 October 2024

Kathleen told Lawdit to submit the renewal for the State of the Map registration in the US. They should be getting the money soon.

Argentina Declaration of Actual Use

Due by March. £695 to file.

Action item

Dorothea to check with the Finance committee if the LWG has 700 GBP left to spend this year for the Argentina trademark renewal.

Reportage

OSMF move to the EU

Briefly discussed in two parts - before Guillaume joined and after.

The board is waiting for the OSMF board election.

Queries from Local Chapter: OpenStreetMap France – Translation of community guidelines

Discussed in two parts - before Guillaume joined and after.

Dermot looked at the comments of TomTom's lawyer on the document and added a question about nuance of some words.

Suggestions

  • Send the document back to the authors.
  • Guillaume to look at the question that Dermot added.

Action item

Dermot and Guillaume will discuss Dermot's comments in the LWG Signal chat room and decide on the suitability of the work.

Licensing of OSM GPS traces #56357

OSM contributors, when they upload their GPS traces to OSM, have the option to make their traces public or keep them private for themselves. OSM GPS traces are used for tracing. JOSM still has a mode where one can load the accumulated set of all public OSM GPS traces of a small area.

On OSM GPX data

  • Infra-structurally, we do have a separate parallel data store for that kind of data.
  • We don't produce full GPX dumps anymore and no one's interested in fixing them.
  • It's different from the OSM database itself in that there's absolutely no originality in that database.
  • The traces do not show up on the map by default, they are a form of metadata.

Suggestion: Say that the GPX traces are part of the database.

Regarding the research

  • The researcher probably wants to download all the OSM GPS traces.
  • The OSM traces might not be the only trace data he's working with.
  • He may be releasing the tooling for his project so that his results can be replicated probably, or training an AI model.

On scraping the GPS data

  • In the privacy policy it says that the GPX data for an area can be downloaded via the API.
  • If he uses JOSM to download many regions, this might get him banned. Downloading just Hing Kong would probably be ok.
  • He might have downloaded the data already, as he's not asking the LWG on how to do it.
  • He would have to download it via the API.

Other points mentioned

  • We have very poor tools for ensuring that for instance the data subject rights of contributors are respected by people that we convey this data to.
  • Forks of comma.ai were submitting GPS traces of their users to OSM.

On licence of OSM GPX traces

  • Dermot found a forum discussion speculating that traces are probably not copyrightable, because they reflect the actual movements.
  • The individual traces are probably not copyrightable, just like the individual names of a road are probably not copyrightable. But they're part of the database as a whole.
  • If each trace is not licensable in its own right and the researcher is in principle not producing a data set that resembles these parts, it's difficult to see how ODbL would apply to any downstream work. It would still have to be attributed.
  • Each track log itself is probably itself not covered by ODbL, but rather the mechanism they were procured.

Close to (and before) the licence change, the licence of the GPS traces was documented as CC BY-SA.

On GPX traces and the OSM data licence change

  • We never bothered asking people who had uploaded GPS traces to relicense their traces.
  • We had a redaction process for people who didn't agree to the license change, but we didn't redact their GPS traces.
  • We haven't bothered fixing the export since 2013.
  • An LWG member remembered discussions that suggested that the traces should remain under a CC licence.
  • Unclear what the licence of GPX traces after the licence change is.
  • It would seem valid for us to take the view that the database of the GPS traces is also ODbL, as it is stored in an ODbL database.

Dorothea pointed out that the GPX licence after the licence change is ODbL, as https://osmfoundation.org/wiki/Licence/Historic/We_Are_Changing_The_License mentions: "What license is being changed? We are changing the current CC-BY-SA 2.0 to Open Database License (OdbL) 1.0. The license that covers the contributed geodata (nodes, ways, relations) and the GPX traces that you upload. That is, anything that is in the Postgresql database and which we explicitly publish, like planet.osm."

Action item

Kathleen to reply that data is either CC-BY-SA or ODbL, depending on the date of the data.

Answered Oct 8 by Kathleen

Links shared during the meeting

Government of Alberta licence #56650

Discussed 52’ after start, after Guillaume Rischard and Tom Lee left. Suggestion: Create an FAQ about Canadian licences.

Action item

Kathleen to add a note on the OSMF website https://osmfoundation.org/wiki/OGL_Canada_and_local_variants, so that before submitting, people can look at some of the Canadian licences examples and tell us if there is any difference, beyond the region and name.

DONE 11/17

Austria dead link on Copyright page

Action item

Kathleen to open an OPS issue, so that Tom Hughes can fix it.

Oct 8: Kathleen opened issue at https://github.com/openstreetmap/openstreetmap-website
Confirmed done: https://github.com/openstreetmap/openstreetmap-website/issues/5253

TAPSI #56927

  • They are adamant that they are doing the right thing, because they have our logo on the map.
  • If they just have logo, it's not enough attribution.
  • One of the LWG members couldn't access their maps.
  • They seem to have changed the OSM wiki to call it a "watermark".

Suggestion: Ask them to show implementation of attribution.

Survey in German

If any of the LWG members speaking German is interested, they can fill it.

Trademarks

openstreets-4-open-street-map

Dermot McNally had a look and German and English were consistent in their uses of language.

Dermot to check with Tom Hummel, once the later feels better

Next Generation OpenStreetMap and osm.ng

On domain osm.ng (not "openstreetmap.ng")

  • Currently redirects to GitHub page.
  • Nigerian community is interested in the domain.
  • "osm" in the domain is used in the OpenStreetMap context, that is infringement of trademark.
  • OSMF is probably not interested in the domain.
  • If Kamil would give the domain to OSMF we would take it, as the Nigerian OSM community has expressed interest.

Suggestions

  • Ask to make it clear that OSMF does not endorse the project.
  • Ask to change the name of the project.
  • Ask for stronger disclaimer.
  • Ask to transfer the domain if stops using the domain for OpenStreetMap.

On project

  • Project falls under community use.
  • The project website says "not sponsored or endorsed by the OSM Foundation".

Decision seemed to be: Ask for a stronger disclaimer.

Action item

Kathleen to email Kamil Monicz.

Dorothea's note: The texts below were added to the online document with the agenda during the meeting.

Excerpts from policy
Use of the OSM marks to name software components, packages, minor tools, repositories and similar that process or work specifically with OpenStreetMap data is permissible as long as the use follows the rest of this policy. The permission does not include use of the OSM marks in a confusing manner, such as to market software products in a way that implies they are official OSMF products. To avoid possible confusion, please use appropriate disclaimers, such as those in Section 2.2.

osm.ng
In 4.1:
You need a trademark licence to register or use a domain name that contains an OSM mark. Please don’t register a domain that looks or sounds similar to an OSM mark, or includes a misspelled OSM mark, as that can confuse OpenStreetMap users.

3.5. Use of remixed logos
Use of remixed logos is permissible for

  • free open source tools and editors specifically for OpenStreetMap data
  • local chapter and user group logos

as long as the use follows the rest of this policy.

Please include this notice, or something similar, when you use a mark outside of the OSM projects: [Wordmark / name of logo] is a trademark of the OpenStreetMap Foundation, and is used with their permission. [We / this product / this project] are not endorsed by or affiliated with the OpenStreetMap Foundation.

The notice should appear near the first use of any OSM mark.

Excerpt from project
OpenStreetMap-NG is an unofficial Python fork of openstreetmap.org. It's on a mission to push the boundaries of OpenStreetMap and provide a better experience for all users. It's simply the Next Generation of OpenStreetMap.

Choosing names similar to OpenStreetMap in Persian #56267

  • The strings don't look similar to LWG members, but they don't know Persian.
  • Google Translate translates the second string as OpenStreetMap, all one word, with the correct capitalisation.
  • LWG doesn't recommend anything that's too close or could lead to confusion.

Action item

Kathleen to reply to Amiria Maher.

Kathleen 10/7: Done

Any other business

Compatibility of the licence Government of Japan Standard Terms of Use (Version 2)

For next time.

Next Meetings

Monday 18 November 2024 (back to winter hours - 1800)
Monday 09 December 2024, 1800 UTC

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